Player Economny is Broken outdated and bad for RP

[*El Cept]

Hey

I just joined up again after a long long break. I have been having issues roleplaying a merchant character.

Every time someone approaches they go on some diatribe about not having a merchant box out for them to look at. Then when they exclaim the wares are crap roleplaying some sort of thing that because I'm not carrying epic level items I'm an idiot. Buying nothing..thus I'm still unable to afford a sign, and merchant box.

They then go and buy some items or sell items to an NPC that's got worse items and gear...

I doubt anyone will respect this. But maybe your player base is non existent because of the fact NOTHING is possible unless your a level 30 including roleplaying.

I've seen everything from RP disputes over level gaps that should not exist. Everyone walking around throwing around coin that could buy out half a sigil without effort. And a broken economy where only weapons are being purchased and sold.

All of the above makes rolepalying that much more difficult. Half the time people are giving me money for charity .. which makes no sense at all.

I don't want to have to sell only enchanted armor and weapons to actually enjoy roleplaying a merchant.

And I should not have to see epic levels running lower levels through dungeons so they can participate in the game.

Anyways I'm not sure what to do other than meta game cheat and abuse mechanics to actually have a decent rp session without some guy laughing at me for my inventory and then go buy or sell the the same things to an NPC..

Either fix the economy by reverting everyone to level 10, and delete all items. or gain some awareness of your surrounding and Role play the scenario better.

You can't do both. Buy off an NPC than joke that another player is broke because they don't have epic gear for sale. , when in actuality they have thousands of coins and could live like kings, given how much food and drink costs.

[*El Cept]

Hey

I just joined up again after a long long break. I have been having issues roleplaying a merchant character.

Every time someone approaches they go on some diatribe about not having a merchant box out for them to look at. Then when they exclaim the wares are crap roleplaying some sort of thing that because I'm not carrying epic level items I'm an idiot. Buying nothing..thus I'm still unable to afford a sign, and merchant box.

They then go and buy some items or sell items to an NPC that's got worse items and gear...

I doubt anyone will respect this. But maybe your player base is non existent because of the fact NOTHING is possible unless your a level 30 including roleplaying.

I've seen everything from RP disputes over level gaps that should not exist. Everyone walking around throwing around coin that could buy out half a sigil without effort. And a broken economy where only weapons are being purchased and sold.

All of the above makes rolepalying that much more difficult. Half the time people are giving me money for charity .. which makes no sense at all.

I don't want to have to sell only enchanted armor and weapons to actually enjoy roleplaying a merchant.

And I should not have to see epic levels running lower levels through dungeons so they can participate in the game.

Anyways I'm not sure what to do other than meta game cheat and abuse mechanics to actually have a decent rp session without some guy laughing at me for my inventory and then go buy or sell the the same things to an NPC..

Either fix the economy by reverting everyone to level 10, and delete all items. or gain some awareness of your surrounding and Role play the scenario better.

You can't do both. Buy off an NPC than joke that another player is broke because they don't have epic gear for sale. , when in actuality they have thousands of coins and could live like kings, given how much food and drink costs.

A simple and easy fix for this would be to increase the cost of starting gold and "Some" drops and items by adding additional zeroes.

For example Ale 300jp or Jink.


Potion of barkskin 226 just add a zero now it's 2026 gold(jink)
Potion of cure moderate wounds 225 to 2025
Potion of cure serious wounds 340 gp to 3400


BAM economy fixed.

[*Darkrob]

Starting as a merchant is not always easy. Sometimes it takes time. Sometimes you gotta work with established merchants before you can set out on your own. There's all sorts of ways. If people comment on your setup, take it in character. It's like the equivalent of setting up a small unknown shop in between two already established commercial giants. People are gonna pass you by until you have made your mark.

Also, item/vault wipes do not work. Yeah, it puts you all on the same page but then what about 6 months from now? New players join and they feel left out. We do it again... and again each time? That's kill more than the economy. It'd kill the mod.

You've already begun getting known. My characters clan has been RPing for over a week around/with your character. It's not merchant RP but it is establishing RP.

I understand things can get frustrating, and changes are coming in things like crafting and enchanting that you might be able to jump right into when released. Just keep playing your mage, keep RPing with those who want to and don't worry about those who don't.

[*Mr_Otyugh]

I'm not sure where to start to even unravel this, but lets start from the obvious: calm down.

We're not going to revert everything to level 10, simply because that is an insane proposition to sort out player economy. If you wish to play in a server with level 10 restriction, it is probably something you should choose based on server choices in nwnlist.com, SCoD is and has always been max level 30 - level adjustment, and I don't foresee that changing, especially not for this reason.

At the moment we're also not looking to make an item wipe. Not a very popular proposition.

I'm also not seeing any point in making everything more expensive, if that is indeed what you are proposing? If anything, the NPC store prices need more fixing to make things cheaper in many accounts.

Roleplaying is very possible even at level 1, you just need to change what you are offering. Level 30 characters probably are not interested in power that a low level character is offering, including items that only offer some form of bonus. That much is granted. But then if you are about offering roleplay opportunities... perhaps offering +X items isn't the best way to go at it? If alchemy is something of a chosen venue, then you could consider offering interesting alchemical concoctions, ointments and oils as an IC alternative.

One of my most influential characters actually never got past level 12, despite it being very easy on this server. I just never really got into it.

[*El Cept]

Starting as a merchant is not always easy. Sometimes it takes time. Sometimes you gotta work with established merchants before you can set out on your own. There's all sorts of ways. If people comment on your setup, take it in character. It's like the equivalent of setting up a small unknown shop in between two already established commercial giants. People are gonna pass you by until you have made your mark.

Also, item/vault wipes do not work. Yeah, it puts you all on the same page but then what about 6 months from now? New players join and they feel left out. We do it again... and again each time? That's kill more than the economy. It'd kill the mod.

You've already begun getting known. My characters clan has been RPing for over a week around/with your character. It's not merchant RP but it is establishing RP.

I understand things can get frustrating, and changes are coming in things like crafting and enchanting that you might be able to jump right into when released. Just keep playing your mage, keep RPing with those who want to and don't worry about those who don't.

I should not have to Enchant and craft weapons and items as an arcane sundries salesmen. I don't wish to sell or enchant items. I have no interest in doing that at all in anyway.

I have feats in potion making.. completely useless.

And to address other posts. I'm calm. I'm annoyed but calm. I have not made a single potion sale in a number of days. Dealing with what I said above, being made fun of for not having Epic level gear. Over and over and over.

So what I should just cheat like everyone else have epics run me through dungeons until I can buy items from epic vendors who are the only ones buying and selling anything? Just so I can RP ?

Having level mostly level 30s will discourage new players from staying, caring about the content when everyone around them acts like a god.

The entire economy runs around playing buying god like items. And then people calling you poor for not having them.

Just because I'm noticing an annoying trend and pointing it out, does not mean I'm (A) being insulting or (B_ flaming pissed off keyboard throwing fedoring wearing neckbeard.

As to why D-Lv is a great idea and why telling someone to look for another server that better suits them is rude.. I give this reply. Why do you need to be level 30? What does it really add to play a character at the end of their career for years.

And why do you need to be rude in suggesting that I leave because I found an issue role playing a vastly illogical bit of RP. and for the record they're are no other servers worth playing. That arn't filled to the very brim full of corruption, BS and children. At least the ridiculous antics enrich this server to some degree.

It's like I tried to shoot a puppy or something by stating issues with other players. Might as well be a Conservative at a SJW rally, over gun control. Jebus christ.

[*Sinlinara]

I'm going to just table the economy being broken topic because that's a can of worms that I'm not interested in discussing right now. (Also because it's not.)

Let's talk about what you're suggesting we do instead.

Reverting everyone to Lv 10 is rather pointless considering how easy it is to reach maximum level on the server. People would be Lv 30 again in less than a week. In contrast, deleting all items is a surefire way to drive everyone away from the server and send us back to a steady population of 7 people. What's more, anything you expect it would accomplish would only be a short-term fluctuation that would eventually revert back to where we are now because nothing would have really changed; people would obtain epic items just as they always have and then try to sell them to other people.

Ale for 300gp? I suppose that's inflation at work, but if you want to talk about unrealistic RP then that's about as unrealistic as it gets. But increasing the value of items past 300gp is rather moot considering the cap at which merchants will purchase items. I assume what you really want us to do is to increase that cap, which would have a lot of consequences to consider. In particular, the entire purpose of the cap is to reduce the wealth disparity between high-level and low-level characters. It's because of the cap that you can easily obtain +5 Equipment from other players for around 500gp. Why? Because they don't want it, there are a bunch of them, and the maximum price they can sell it for otherwise is 300gp.
It is currently possible to obtain around 100k from a day's worth of grinding and selling to merchants at Lv 30. Increasing the vendor cap would inflate that by a considerable amount. How much? Well, that's hard to say exactly and it would depend on the amount that you raised the cap by. If we raised it to just 400gp I would estimate that I could probably get something like 140k a day, and 185k if we raised it to 500gp. Increasing it to 3400gp would make the wealth disparity between low-levels and high-levels ridiculous. Which, in turn, would inflate the price of basic +5 gear even higher (to say nothing of purple gear) out of the reach of the low-level characters, which given your resentment of level gaps I expect isn't something you particularly want.

And in regards to both of these suggestions, basic non-magical gear would still remain cheap and obsolete because at the end of the day that's what it is once you get past Lv 5, just like it is in Pen and Paper games. There is no demand for them except from NPCs and new characters, the latter of whom easily purchase it from the former with their starting gold and then don't need to replace with anything except for magical arms and armor.
I suspect the real issue here is that for some reason you expect that to not be the case. I'm sorry to say that that's just how D&D works. If you don't like the game, I recommend Edge of the Empire by Fantasy Flight Games.

[*Darkrob]

If you want to focus on selling things that very few people buy, that's entirely your choice. You try to sell what you wish. There are ways to playing a merchant that are open to you. How you use them is up to you.

As for needing to be X level to rp or make your mark... That's an incorrect assumption. Over the last week we have had several people interacting, spending money, rping and doing all sorts of things do to interactions with you and guess what? We have zero idea what level you are. Rp comes to those who make it no matter where you are on the chain.

[*El Cept]

I'm not sure where to start to even unravel this, but lets start from the obvious: calm down.

We're not going to revert everything to level 10, simply because that is an insane proposition to sort out player economy. If you wish to play in a server with level 10 restriction, it is probably something you should choose based on server choices in nwnlist.com, SCoD is and has always been max level 30 - level adjustment, and I don't foresee that changing, especially not for this reason.

At the moment we're also not looking to make an item wipe. Not a very popular proposition.

I'm also not seeing any point in making everything more expensive, if that is indeed what you are proposing? If anything, the NPC store prices need more fixing to make things cheaper in many accounts.

Roleplaying is very possible even at level 1, you just need to change what you are offering. Level 30 characters probably are not interested in power that a low level character is offering, including items that only offer some form of bonus. That much is granted. But then if you are about offering roleplay opportunities... perhaps offering +X items isn't the best way to go at it? If alchemy is something of a chosen venue, then you could consider offering interesting alchemical concoctions, ointments and oils as an IC alternative.

One of my most influential characters actually never got past level 12, despite it being very easy on this server. I just never really got into it.

I can't afford an alchemist bench item thingy for crafting.

I can't afford a sign and have no sales all day every day, I cant afford a merchant box to sell theese items.

All I can do is adventure and get a few coins. and make up ridiculous rp as to sell a few items here and there.. MOST of which I have sold were given out of charity, then they go and buy and sell from an NPC and spend more coin lose more selling and buying.

That's all I'm trying to say it's starting to get very boring just standing there. And that's not a troll post. It's not saying something to get a reaction. it's not saying I hate the server and everyone here. It's a basic observation of a craptastic experience, like they used to make circa 1998. Before the term TROLL existed and it was not illegal to say something negative.

[*El Cept]

I'm going to just table the economy being broken topic because that's a can of worms that I'm not interested in discussing right now. (Also because it's not.)

Let's talk about what you're suggesting we do instead.

Reverting everyone to Lv 10 is rather pointless considering how easy it is to reach maximum level on the server. People would be Lv 30 again in less than a week. In contrast, deleting all items is a surefire way to drive everyone away from the server and send us back to a steady population of 7 people. What's more, anything you expect it would accomplish would only be a short-term fluctuation that would eventually revert back to where we are now because nothing would have really changed; people would obtain epic items just as they always have and then try to sell them to other people.

Ale for 300gp? I suppose that's inflation at work, but if you want to talk about unrealistic RP then that's about as unrealistic as it gets. But increasing the value of items past 300gp is rather moot considering the cap at which merchants will purchase items. I assume what you really want us to do is to increase that cap, which would have a lot of consequences to consider. In particular, the entire purpose of the cap is to reduce the wealth disparity between high-level and low-level characters. It's because of the cap that you can easily obtain +5 Equipment from other players for around 500gp. Why? Because they don't want it, there are a bunch of them, and the maximum price they can sell it for otherwise is 300gp.
It is currently possible to obtain around 100k from a day's worth of grinding and selling to merchants at Lv 30. Increasing the vendor cap would inflate that by a considerable amount. How much? Well, that's hard to say exactly and it would depend on the amount that you raised the cap by. If we raised it to just 400gp I would estimate that I could probably get something like 140k a day, and 185k if we raised it to 500gp. Increasing it to 3400gp would make the wealth disparity between low-levels and high-levels ridiculous. Which, in turn, would inflate the price of basic +5 gear even higher (to say nothing of purple gear) out of the reach of the low-level characters, which given your resentment of level gaps I expect isn't something you particularly want.

And in regards to both of these suggestions, basic non-magical gear would still remain cheap and obsolete because at the end of the day that's what it is once you get past Lv 5, just like it is in Pen and Paper games. There is no demand for them except from NPCs and new characters, the latter of whom easily purchase it from the former with their starting gold and then don't need to replace with anything except for magical arms and armor.
I suspect the real issue here is that for some reason you expect that to not be the case. I'm sorry to say that that's just how D&D works. If you don't like the game, I recommend Edge of the Empire by Fantasy Flight Games.

you could be more rude.. but you might actually have to punch me in the face to actually accomplish that.

Because I don't like the balance issue I should quit playing D&D which I have been playing since 2nd edition.

That's how D&D works when your DM does not know hot to balance a Campaign in a Pen and Paper setting(not the server, which other than the above issue is wonderful, again for the record).

[*Darkrob]

Not illegal to say something negative so long as it's respectful. We're all permitted to give our say. We just gotta make sure we're calm and open to discussion