Sigil: City of Doors

Darkrob,Nov 2 2017 wrote: Not sure what you're referring to. I'm defending the idea of Proxies and Factions. I'm simply looking for a way to make it so all factions are useful and player friendly.

I failed to delete that in time, sorry! >.<

I misread what you said initially all the way.

DaftyXIII,Nov 2 2017 wrote:

Darkrob,Nov 2 2017 wrote: Not sure what you're referring to. I'm defending the idea of Proxies and Factions. I'm simply looking for a way to make it so all factions are useful and player friendly.

I failed to delete that in time, sorry! >.<

I misread what you said initially all the way.

It's all good :)

I'd say the Dustmen would take offense at being associated with "Despair", or any other feeling :).

Said that, it would seem that more than a mechanical, structural reorganization we would need a change in the players' mindset.

It feels like the presented issues could be solved with an OOC willingness to be inclusive and let other players participate, regardless of our characters actually "winning", "losing" or something in between.

As long as characters have options, and the story proceeds in a rewarding fashion for all, dwelling on those who gained the most from the developments should simply not happen, much less discourage DM involvement or certain approaches (faction conflict was mentioned in the thread).

More than changing the world itself, perhaps we should change and in so doing affect the world.

Taking offense be admiting having emotion.

Lucadia,Nov 3 2017 wrote: Taking offense be admiting having emotion.

Yes, of course, because the True Death is a journey: none of them has really reached it, aside from the mindless Undead and perhaps Skall.

But don't tell them :P.

Anything to add that is on topic?

Tbh, I think Mr. O's grouping still makes the most sense for our purposes:

Mr_Otyugh,Nov 1 2017 wrote:I know the old grouping I made ages ago was:
Triad of Law - Harmonium, Mercykillers, Guvners
We Work For Ourselves - Fated, Free League, Revolutionary League
Gods Are Just Men - Athar, Believers of the Source, Sign of One
Life Has No Purpose - Bleak Cabal, Doomguard, Dustmen
Immersed By Diversity - Society of Sensation, Transcendent Order, Xaositects

Melmoth,Nov 3 2017 wrote:Said that, it would seem that more than a mechanical, structural reorganization we would need a change in the players' mindset.

It feels like the presented issues could be solved with an OOC willingness to be inclusive and let other players participate, regardless of our characters actually "winning", "losing" or something in between.

I think a lot of players are more than willing to do this, but this would formalize it on the server. I also think people need to keep in mind that it's not about "win/lose", so much as it's about the RP itself.

I think that the amount of issues and disagreements that come up just from trying to group the factions into groups of three rather indicates that they aren't something which can be sensibly grouped without overlooking a massive amount of nuance.

Sinlinara,Nov 3 2017 wrote:I think that the amount of issues and disagreements that come up just from trying to group the factions into groups of three rather indicates that they aren't something which can be sensibly grouped without overlooking a massive amount of nuance.

Not necessarily. Mr. O's grouping is based on shared interests/theme and alliances. There are other groupings, which are in lore, but they're not actual grouping. I don't think we would lose a whole lot of nuance with Mr. O's grouping, to be frank.

A lot of these groupings should they become large groups of players do not make sense. Some are based off IC alliances, other like the Sensates allied with the Xaos or Athars with the Sign of one, or anyone allied with the Revolutionary League is just going to be constant sources of conflict and mutual embarrassment.

This is a lot of reading to through and I would rather not misunderstand anything here, so I raise a few questions taht may / may not have been answered...

1) Was the groupings under one banner to be formed under one ideology?

2) Are the groupings to lock out the other 15 factions to be joined out in the future?

wrote: A lot of these groupings should they become large groups of players do not make sense. Some are based off IC alliances, other like the Sensates allied with the Xaos or Athars with the Sign of one, or anyone allied with the Revolutionary League is just going to be constant sources of conflict and mutual embarrassment.

also I feel that's a per individual thing rather than a faction as a whole, even then some of them (if not all) are really for personal gain if anything. I guess I don't see what will change with that?

As to the Revolutionary League being a constant sources of conflict and mutual embarrassment.

What's bad about conflict? It happens all the time behind a iron curtain IC.

what's cool about the bellow..

wrote: We Work For Ourselves - Fated, Free League, Revolutionary League

you got the Fated and Free League who work hand in hand with keeping the bazaar under check with permits, and Revolutionary League share similar ideas with Free League, main reason I believe the Free League is still work as a whole rather than total anarchy is watching to make sure they got each others backs. the Revolutionary League still works in groups, but more cells than anything really. Fated also have ability to pull some BS that no other faction can get away with and infact get away with it 100% if the did in fact take what belonged to them appropriately to the factions ways. So as a result, they can be capable to pull strings as needed at times which can benefit the Revolutionary League.

I can go on with the above, but would rather NOT :P Point is they can benefit from each other to gain their goals

Overall tho the Revolutionary League has had some bad dealing in the past, thing is they sought direct conflict and battle with death that would soon follow, rather than just desensitized information to the select few, and such to cause damage over time than max damage in as little time as possible (I can be wrong about that tho)

apologies if I misunderstood anything, but it's late for me really..


EDIT : I must have done 15 edits by now after publishing >.<