Triad Discussions - Issues To Solve

[*Tomekk]

The aasimar quirks a brow at the drow, honestly dumbfounded by her reply.

"Did you not catch the word 'recruit' being used in the same sentence as 'greenhorn'? It was not meant as an insult, you are merely using it to create further tension.

The goal of the city-wide suggestion was to help recruits better understand the role they and their allies play in our alliance, as you have also said, so that potential issues can be eliminated at the very beginning... not left to fester, as we clearly seeing evidence of.

As for gangs, the only reason people turn to them is because they want to feel safe in numbers, the same way more capable people join a faction. You cannot condemn a young boy for seeking safety, if he is willing to change for the better, can you? But your suggestion of using the outposts as a sort of seed within the affected areas is also a good one, I would back that aswell."

Then turns to Garen, simply nodding approval at what the judge said, with a smile.

[*Taurus Daggerknight]

"This might sound a little odd coming from a Mercykiller himself, but I feel this should be noted... we never at any point wanted to arrest people and bring them strieght to the Prison.

The Prison is a place for the guilty, those whom the Law has declared criminal and wanting. It is a place of punishment, not detainment pending trial.

With that established, what we -do- wish to for is the authority to arrest and detain criminals in assistance with the Harmonium. Anyone we catch has always been brought to the Harmonium, unless they are fugatives already declared by the law. This is not us striving for more rights as has often been percieved. This is us acting as auxillary forces in assistance with the Harmonium, as allies. It baffles me that this act has in the past been seen as overstepping or a desire for more power.

Now just as we do -not- want alter the balance of power- where in the Harmonium has ultimate say in matters of arrest and pre-trial detainment- we are not ready to grant the right of sentancing or even higher fine enforcement. Fact of the matter is, officers all too frequently abuse the power of throwing down fines, often times beyond their authority."

Dace looks to the Harmonium officers. "Do not take that as a jab, for it is not. It is simply a fact that occurs.

Ultimately, it comes down to this; there is no need to change the specific authority or duties of our respective factions, but there IS a need to allow for more cross faction assitance. To that end, as I suggested....allow the Red Death agents to act in support and bring sighted and untried criminals to the Harmonium outposts or agents for further processing. That way they need not fear us for trying to subvert their role, and at the same time we do not grow concerned over them passing unjust punishment.

I would also like to suggest the establishment of a more permanent Triad council. Fact is, much of the tensions and confusion occurs because our Orders simply do not start talking to each other until a crisis reaches its boiling point. Let us establish a headquarter- not in each Factions base, but in a new property so as to avoid fears of over extended influence. Here we may convene as we do now, to discuss matters of law and crime -together- rather than individually.

[*DarkArc]

Charae looked amused at the aasimar's first comment, though also a touch disappointed in her.

She then addressed the group as a whole. "Justice Dace is correct. Our order has never wanted to arrest people and bring them to the Prison. As he said, our Prison is the end of the process, not the beginning. While I cannot speak for those in the past that may have presented this idea, I and the rest of my Justices here do not condone these actions.

With that said, Chief Garen knows full well why I would be against seeing Notaries be given the authority to enforce higher fines. I believe the chief remembers a previous incident of where a Harmonium placed an extortionate fine on a citizen without authorization from the courts or the Mercykillers. It's simply too much room for potential abuse. If the Fraternity wishes them to have more leeway in determining criminal charges, that's not our domain.

It is also my belief that any member of the Triad who witnesses a crime should assist if not pursue the criminal and arrest them in order to take them to the Barracks. This strikes me as simple common sense and, if this had been established, then that incident in the Hive where one of my Justices was caught in interference trying to arrest a Doomguard that murdered a Harmonium may have never happened. Do we want our answer to the families of the affected be that no one tried to catch the killer because we weren't allowed to?"

[*LiquidDreamer]

"I second the recommendations made by Garen and I am willing and able to help organization such events. I also like what Sir Dace said as well and I can that going a long way to helping both factions maintain law and order. " Chari adds in between points being made by all.

[*Hydra]

Shana finaly spoke in a very calm yet dogmatic and authoritative tone.

- I find the proposition of the Mercykillers to actually manage fines absolutely absurd and feels like a vain attempt of political power grabbing. If WE, the Harmonium cannot issue fines how can we assert our authority ? Do you expect our Brothers and Sisters to nicely ask a Guvner if something is legal or illegal then go to the Mercykiller for him or her to collect the fine every time they want to do their duty ? This is absolutely unacceptable and counter productive.

As for Justice Dace proposition. The Mercykillers have already the great and honourable duty of hunting down committed criminals among the planes and guarding the prison, having you guarding the streets alongside the harmonium is also counter productive, you have better things to do. However your assistance is welcome, but having people "detained" in the prison of the faction people slang as "The red death" before they get put to Trial is perfectly unacceptable and will only tarnish even more the image of the Triad.

I think that if the Mercykillers want unity, then they should drop their badges and enlist in the Harmonium, its you who have decided to be a different actor of law in this city not us, this is why we have troubles actually working together. We only are under a different banner because you think that "Justice" itself more important than its purpose : Harmony.

[*Plaxy100]

I think thats something we can all agree on, More Co-operation less Infighting. Its something that has exposed us. Although I don't think Fraternity should be left out in the cross training. While not Martial members, it still be a good Idea for the judges to see how things work in the barracks and prison, and just as good for each members to get a closer study on the inner workings of law.

While seamless movement between factions is still many steps off, its not something we should Denounce all together. Perhaps someone that joins the Mercykillers is found to have a better pentiant for being a patrol person or visa versa, got Harmoniam that is found better at dispencing justice. It would be far more benificial to both sides when each Cog can be re-corrected when one receives a mismatched piece rather than try to force its installation.

[*DarkArc]

Charae looked at Shana in disbelief. "Have you been paying attention? Have you been even for the most minute amount of time been listening to what was said? The Harmonium and Fraternity have always been unauthorized to directly issue any punishment consisting of more than a minor fine to not exceed one hundred gold pieces without the signature of a Mercykiller of at least the rank of Justice.

"That isn't 'political power grabbing' as you so eloquently put it. That has been policy for as long as I can remember, and I am sure every Harmonium here is aware of, save perhaps for yourself, which makes me question the quality of your training. You also clearly didn't hear Justice Dace and I just say we don't want or condone detaining anyone at the Prison that hasn't been convicted. I've lost track of how many times we've said it.

"Honestly, I am not sure what else to tell you other than clean the wax out of your ears and pay attention. I am not even going to comment about your very last remark."

OOC Link

[*Viper901]

Factor, you mentioned that you should have the authority to arrest and take to the Barracks for the Harmonium. I cannot support that. The right to arrest lies squarely with the Harmonium. It is their right only. That is why I recommended the right to detain, a matter similar to arrest but not official until a Harmonium officer makes it official. This would permit you to take lawbreakers off the street until the Harmonium collect them.

Although we try to find common ground, we must also remember our core duties. Just as you bristle at the thought of the Harmonium increasing fines, and therefore trodding on your realm, so must we ensure you do not trod on theirs.

[*DarkArc]

"My apologies, Garen. That was an error in translation of my Common. It is not my mother tongue. Detain is what I meant. It makes perfect sense for the Mercykillers to detain a lawbreaker, take them to the Barracks, and for the Harmonium to make the decision whether or not to process them."

[*Viper901]

He would nod

Of course, I understand. Yes... I could support that method.