"Remember, Julius... obeying the law does not mean upholding justice nor is justice only brought upon the unlawful. We all have our own reasons for supporting the law in this city. This is not due to a sence of duty or responsibility. It is because it keeps the peace. Breaking a law, to bring down the guilty and unjust... is not a betrayal of duty.
Law is not always just, Justice is not always lawful and order is not always lawful or just. We simply have to find common ground with which we can all agree. Comprimise so we can execute all of our duties upon our common enemy."
Harmonium Meeting
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*Selebius
- Posts: 1073
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
"Order is bigger than all of us... and laws are what help us grasp this fact. They are the guidelines we mortals need to help us to not stray from the path.
If a law is not just people meet and review it and then, if necessary, change it.
Order and laws are nothing we can bend to fit our own needs- indeed they demand of us that we obey them... that we try and fit their demands.
Our personal reasons, what we feel or what we think is right do not matter when it comes to Order or Law.
Laws should not be discareded, order not be ignoed only because suddenly it gets inconvenient to follow them.
And before you try to hold our own seventh tenet against us I want to remind you that it also is a law.. a rule... and so far every mercikiller who abused it found Justice.
This is order. This is law. We are bound to it, we serve it. Not vice versa."
If a law is not just people meet and review it and then, if necessary, change it.
Order and laws are nothing we can bend to fit our own needs- indeed they demand of us that we obey them... that we try and fit their demands.
Our personal reasons, what we feel or what we think is right do not matter when it comes to Order or Law.
Laws should not be discareded, order not be ignoed only because suddenly it gets inconvenient to follow them.
And before you try to hold our own seventh tenet against us I want to remind you that it also is a law.. a rule... and so far every mercikiller who abused it found Justice.
This is order. This is law. We are bound to it, we serve it. Not vice versa."
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*Darkrob
- Posts: 1097
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
"Your seventh tenet is a law that tells you to break laws to achieve your justice. No matter your explanation, it is simply that.
But we are not here to debate law and justice. We are here to crush the Revolution. The Harmonium will move forward with plans to remove them. We are soldiers. We are the hand of Order and the Revolution will learn the hard way what it is to oppose us. We want our allies along side us and will uphold the laws that keep us as the Triad. We will not, however, bow to demands to uphold law or justice at the cost of order... but we will work with our allies to avoid such choices before being forced to make them. That is why you are here today. To work together. We must all comprimise"
But we are not here to debate law and justice. We are here to crush the Revolution. The Harmonium will move forward with plans to remove them. We are soldiers. We are the hand of Order and the Revolution will learn the hard way what it is to oppose us. We want our allies along side us and will uphold the laws that keep us as the Triad. We will not, however, bow to demands to uphold law or justice at the cost of order... but we will work with our allies to avoid such choices before being forced to make them. That is why you are here today. To work together. We must all comprimise"
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*Selebius
- Posts: 1073
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
"The seventh tenet is a law that allows a Mercikiller to break certain laws under very specific circumstances.
But anyway... I will support this campaign if it is done for the right reasons.
Perhaps you all are not aware but in a conflict of believes, of ideals there are more ways to lose.
The moment where we abandon the laws, abandon order to gain a fleeting, minor advantage in that moment we did admit that all our laws, all our rules- order itself- has failed.
If we pull this through without lawful support we are nothing more than a bunch of vigilantes.... and tis coflict is no longer a war between Chaos and Law.. but merely two chaotic mobs pummeling each other, talking about higher ideals without embracing them.
Do I want the Anarchists to be destroyed? Yes. But I do not want to become like them. There are other ways. Slower, less spectacular... but more effective.
The strenght of Law always was patience, good planning, smart tactics. Rushing in with superior numbers is.. not."
But anyway... I will support this campaign if it is done for the right reasons.
Perhaps you all are not aware but in a conflict of believes, of ideals there are more ways to lose.
The moment where we abandon the laws, abandon order to gain a fleeting, minor advantage in that moment we did admit that all our laws, all our rules- order itself- has failed.
If we pull this through without lawful support we are nothing more than a bunch of vigilantes.... and tis coflict is no longer a war between Chaos and Law.. but merely two chaotic mobs pummeling each other, talking about higher ideals without embracing them.
Do I want the Anarchists to be destroyed? Yes. But I do not want to become like them. There are other ways. Slower, less spectacular... but more effective.
The strenght of Law always was patience, good planning, smart tactics. Rushing in with superior numbers is.. not."
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*Selebius
- Posts: 1073
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
He nods to the soldier- the whole dispute seems forgotten already when he leans over this map, studying it again.
"I suggest we try to get our original plan moving quickly... and in the meanwhile our superiours work on a way to make the larger campaign fit Sigil's laws."
Giving a wolfish grin he then continues: "They won't know what hit them."
"I suggest we try to get our original plan moving quickly... and in the meanwhile our superiours work on a way to make the larger campaign fit Sigil's laws."
Giving a wolfish grin he then continues: "They won't know what hit them."
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*WhenWizardsWar
- Posts: 353
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
Measure cryptbane thinks for a moment before reaching into a scroll tube at his side and unrolling his own document which he sets on the table, a map like-wise filled with notations and marks.
"Not to long ago I submitted this map to the higher ups the first time i pushed to move against the league, its a map ive made during my time as a rank and file. We are already going to be causing some noise in this operation so if we are going to do this we might as well cross all of our T's and dot all of our I's. The roof top tactics are a problem, and for this I suggest flight spells placed upon our archers and ranged divisions. While we come in from the street level we can have several "flying companies" descend from the "sky" via the other side of the city which would put them technically above our targets, since the city is a big ring our roof top units can literally drop in and secure the roof tops. The second idea i have, and this is going to be the tricky part but its worth the risk, is the under city, we know they move down there...we know they have secure holdings down there and they will likely flee there when we drop the hammer. In order to counter this, we should have a team moving down below, sweeping the known ways they use pushing them up towards the surface.
This has two effects, first of all any one hanging down there will be flushed to the surface, which will have a demoralising effect on those on the surface trying to flee to the under city. If they realise they cannot flee to the under city, they cannot take to the roofs and they cannot leave on foot it will be a severe blow to moral and they will likely make mistakes. I recommend we make this abiit larger, the sewer division securing all known enterances should be in unmarked uniforms except for badges and a code word known only to our officers involved but equally well equipped, its a big place under there so they will need to move fast, ten squads of six men each should allow us to cover most of the under city exits and have room for flying companies to reinforce which ever unit requires additional man power, i already have a good idea of sixty notaries of unquestionable devotion and skill for the task that i can have mobilized within an hour. I don't mind taking point on the streets and being the main head of the spear so to speak, given the design of the hive ward, a squad too big is harder to maneuver but a squad to small wont have the effect we are looking or, if i take some of the higher end notaries a squad of ten to twenty should do".
"Not to long ago I submitted this map to the higher ups the first time i pushed to move against the league, its a map ive made during my time as a rank and file. We are already going to be causing some noise in this operation so if we are going to do this we might as well cross all of our T's and dot all of our I's. The roof top tactics are a problem, and for this I suggest flight spells placed upon our archers and ranged divisions. While we come in from the street level we can have several "flying companies" descend from the "sky" via the other side of the city which would put them technically above our targets, since the city is a big ring our roof top units can literally drop in and secure the roof tops. The second idea i have, and this is going to be the tricky part but its worth the risk, is the under city, we know they move down there...we know they have secure holdings down there and they will likely flee there when we drop the hammer. In order to counter this, we should have a team moving down below, sweeping the known ways they use pushing them up towards the surface.
This has two effects, first of all any one hanging down there will be flushed to the surface, which will have a demoralising effect on those on the surface trying to flee to the under city. If they realise they cannot flee to the under city, they cannot take to the roofs and they cannot leave on foot it will be a severe blow to moral and they will likely make mistakes. I recommend we make this abiit larger, the sewer division securing all known enterances should be in unmarked uniforms except for badges and a code word known only to our officers involved but equally well equipped, its a big place under there so they will need to move fast, ten squads of six men each should allow us to cover most of the under city exits and have room for flying companies to reinforce which ever unit requires additional man power, i already have a good idea of sixty notaries of unquestionable devotion and skill for the task that i can have mobilized within an hour. I don't mind taking point on the streets and being the main head of the spear so to speak, given the design of the hive ward, a squad too big is harder to maneuver but a squad to small wont have the effect we are looking or, if i take some of the higher end notaries a squad of ten to twenty should do".
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*Darkrob
- Posts: 1097
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
Notary Inodine listens to the measure and waits for him to finish before speaking.
"Measure, there are a couple of points of your plan I would like to touch on, if I may.
The first is the idea of aerial artillary. It holds merit but I fear, used at this point, would be a liability. I'm currently not aware of any units that are trained in such things. I think it would become an issue of safety for both the archers and those on the ground, to unleash such a squad unless they were properly practiced and trained. I would suggest the formation of such a unit begin soon so that they may be an asset in future assaults.
Now the undercity... that is an aspect I put little thought into and am thankful for your experience in reminding me. Escape into the tunnels from within the buildings. Having a team under the hot zones, waiting and watching for escapees, is an excellent idea. We'd only need a small squad, maybe three or four officers, both Mercykiller and Harmonium already trained in closed quarter combat, to place below. At this point, we don't want to flood the area above, or below, with people. These first few attacks must be quick and must be quiet. After we gather the bulk of information from those we capture, then we initiate phase two. That will involve entire divisions at that point.
"For now I suggest three target safe houses" he points to the map, "here, here and here. My team will hit this one like I suggested earlier. Your team would take out that one and the third team would take out that one. They would strike just as the light comes to the city and simultainiously. Hit the House, grease the rooftops, cover the tunnels and net all inside. Take them off world, immediately, for interrogation... away from any unexpected help in the city.
Once we gather all we need... we immediately mobilize a couple divisions in the city to sweep them out of entire neighbourhoods"
"Measure, there are a couple of points of your plan I would like to touch on, if I may.
The first is the idea of aerial artillary. It holds merit but I fear, used at this point, would be a liability. I'm currently not aware of any units that are trained in such things. I think it would become an issue of safety for both the archers and those on the ground, to unleash such a squad unless they were properly practiced and trained. I would suggest the formation of such a unit begin soon so that they may be an asset in future assaults.
Now the undercity... that is an aspect I put little thought into and am thankful for your experience in reminding me. Escape into the tunnels from within the buildings. Having a team under the hot zones, waiting and watching for escapees, is an excellent idea. We'd only need a small squad, maybe three or four officers, both Mercykiller and Harmonium already trained in closed quarter combat, to place below. At this point, we don't want to flood the area above, or below, with people. These first few attacks must be quick and must be quiet. After we gather the bulk of information from those we capture, then we initiate phase two. That will involve entire divisions at that point.
"For now I suggest three target safe houses" he points to the map, "here, here and here. My team will hit this one like I suggested earlier. Your team would take out that one and the third team would take out that one. They would strike just as the light comes to the city and simultainiously. Hit the House, grease the rooftops, cover the tunnels and net all inside. Take them off world, immediately, for interrogation... away from any unexpected help in the city.
Once we gather all we need... we immediately mobilize a couple divisions in the city to sweep them out of entire neighbourhoods"
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*Selebius
- Posts: 1073
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
He lets the Notary answer the Measure, listening but as he finds that he has nothing to add the adresses the Mover instead.
"We..." he gestures to Shamus, "... suggest to keep the strike teams small, seven, perhaps eight man so the squad can be broken down into two sections of four or four teams of two.
This allows us some flexibility but also still allows us to move as an unit in areas as tightly build and well populated at this." He gestures at the map.
"However... some backup would be welcome, Sir. On my last raid we captured our target but took heavy losses from ordinary citizens of the Hive taking up arms against us. If this happens we will need some firepower... however smoke and sleep bombs or spells should suffice as these civilians lach the determination and skill of real soldiers of course."
"We..." he gestures to Shamus, "... suggest to keep the strike teams small, seven, perhaps eight man so the squad can be broken down into two sections of four or four teams of two.
This allows us some flexibility but also still allows us to move as an unit in areas as tightly build and well populated at this." He gestures at the map.
"However... some backup would be welcome, Sir. On my last raid we captured our target but took heavy losses from ordinary citizens of the Hive taking up arms against us. If this happens we will need some firepower... however smoke and sleep bombs or spells should suffice as these civilians lach the determination and skill of real soldiers of course."
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*Darkrob
- Posts: 1097
- Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
"If this is done properly" he says to Julius, "we won't have much in the way of civil resistance. The initial intent will be to move in swiftly. Hit the houses," he taps the map in quick motions, "one, two, three, all at the same time. The door get's splintered or blown off the hinges. men move in and scatter the occupants. We capture them inside and out... or below as it may be, chain them and move them out quickly. Hopefully we have siezed control of the houses in mere minutes... not enough time for civilians to gather.
After that, regular Harmonium squads would take control of the area as they usually would after any incident in the wards. They would be prepared for the usual resistance at that point.
These units are strike teams. If we are sloppy to the point that civilians have a chance to be notified in time to gather and attack... we have not been swift enough and deserve the resistance.
After that, regular Harmonium squads would take control of the area as they usually would after any incident in the wards. They would be prepared for the usual resistance at that point.
These units are strike teams. If we are sloppy to the point that civilians have a chance to be notified in time to gather and attack... we have not been swift enough and deserve the resistance.